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Zodiac aircraft type ID

 
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jmaynard



Joined: 27 Feb 2008
Posts: 394
Location: Fairmont, MN (FRM)

PostPosted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 5:49 am    Post subject: Zodiac aircraft type ID Reply with quote

The official ICAO aircraft type ID for the 601 is CH60. That's what I've
been telling ATC, and more than once they've heard that and thought of the
military helicopter with that designator. Any suggestions on how to
disambiguate the two?
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
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AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (got it!)


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 7:10 am    Post subject: Zodiac aircraft type ID Reply with quote

This is an interesting question. I'm training in a Tecnam Echo Super.
My instructor just has me use "light sport". The reasoning is that what
the controllers really want to know is the plane's capabilities and by
indicating it's an LSA you are covered. I guess it's sort of like when
the big boys use "heavy". Communications is the key, and, unlike
controllers who are required to use specific phaseology, pilots can say
whatever they like. I'm sure interested in other opinions.

Ron

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 7:15 am    Post subject: Zodiac aircraft type ID Reply with quote

"Experimental CH60" or "Zenith CH60"


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Gig Giacona



Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1416
Location: El Dorado Arkansas USA

PostPosted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 7:16 am    Post subject: Re: Zodiac aircraft type ID Reply with quote

Nope no suggestion at all. They are the ones in the wrong and all you can do is suggest that they check their ICAO Doc 8643 - Edition 36 again because CH60 is correct. H60 is a Blackhawk and its variants so they may not be hearing the "C."

If they tell you to Hover hold somewhere just fly a really tight circle or tell them, "Sorry, I'm a fixed wing."

It could be worse. The designator for the 640 is CH64. They probably think those guys are flying AH-64 Apaches.

jmaynard wrote:
The official ICAO aircraft type ID for the 601 is CH60. That's what I've
been telling ATC, and more than once they've heard that and thought of the
military helicopter with that designator. Any suggestions on how to
disambiguate the two?
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
Fairmont, MN (FRM) (Yes, that's me!)
AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (got it!)


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 7:26 am    Post subject: Zodiac aircraft type ID Reply with quote

How about "Zodiac" ?

At 06:48 AM 6/18/2008, you wrote:
Quote:
The official ICAO aircraft type ID for the 601 is CH60. That's what I've
been telling ATC, and more than once they've heard that and thought of the
military helicopter with that designator. Any suggestions on how to
disambiguate the two?


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steveadams



Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 191

PostPosted: Wed Jun 18, 2008 10:18 am    Post subject: Re: Zodiac aircraft type ID Reply with quote

I used to file as CH64, but I was constantly having to tell ATC I was a fixed wing Zodiac, not a helicopter, so I gave up. ATC would say to other aircraft "traffic 12 o'clock, an Apache at 8000" and I would think, cool, I wonder if it's close by and then wonder why an Apache is flying around at 8000 ft. Then ATC would point out the other traffic to me and I would put 2 and 2 together and realize I was the Apache. Now I just use the generic "HXB" as a designator and identify myself as "experimental" to ATC to make things easier. Flying a sLSA, I don't know if you have any other option for a designator when filing a flight plan.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 3:49 am    Post subject: Zodiac aircraft type ID Reply with quote

Sure, the CH60 confusion happens often, but it's a matter of education. With enroute controllers it isn't a big issue. Even if they do think you are a helicopter, they aren't going to treat you any differently. So an Apache cruises at 150 knots (maybe) and you cruise at 111. A hundred knots or so is a hundred knots or so.

The PROBLEM is with control towers. They need to immediately have some idea of your approach speed and intent for spacing. And, the problem is made worse where there is a verbal handover from the approach control to the tower and the approach controller reads CH60, tells the tower guy you are a helicopter, and the tower guy vectors you for a landing on the ramp.

That exact scenario has happened to me twice in Key West.

SO...
1. I ALWAYS say ZODIAC 183 alpha mike. That at least raises the question of what the hell is a Zodiac.
2. IF they tower asks, "What type aircraft? "... THEN you know there is confusion and you say, "Single engine, performs like a 172" That's what they REALLY want to know. It's all about approach speed and spacing.

It would be a cold day in hell when I would use "Light Sport" ... I can hear the giggles on the frequency now.

-- FJD
Discussing All the Guy Toys that aren't (clearly) illegal or (blatantly) immoral at http://mostlyflying.com

Pilots: See me at www.flyinflorida.com
Guys: See www.greatguybooks.com
[quote][b]


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Gig Giacona



Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1416
Location: El Dorado Arkansas USA

PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 10:27 am    Post subject: Re: Zodiac aircraft type ID Reply with quote

Because there isn't enough room in the space for aircraft ident. It is 3 or 4 characters max.

psm(at)att.net wrote:
How about "Zodiac" ?


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