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mikecavanagh1(at)hotmail.
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 Posted: Thu May 22, 2014 4:16 pm Post subject: Another Yak-52 'gear up' accident in Belgium ... 18 May 201 |
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Nobody said it would. But some pretty smart people seem to think it helps. You're right, probably would not help you one bit.
On May 22, 2014, at 3:40 PM, keithmckinley <cetopfed(at)gmail.com> wrote:
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Wheel "shmeel", ball, knob whatever. Not gonna save your ass, even close. Hell, I flew a plane that had a button for gear up and one for gear down. Look, it can happen to anyone, I'm sorry it happened to this guy and I'm sorry it happened to that guy (on video) who had an absolute cherry CJ with and M-14 and big prop....but hey, at least he got the flaps down.....
I can say without a doubt I have whipped into the break (CJ and Miltary) and did a tight 180 to land and after landing thought I'm not sure if I ever checked the gear. Maybe I did subconsciously, maybe not. In any case, thank God for muscle memory and First Officers.......
--------
Keith McKinley
700HS
X26 Sebastian, FL
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=423610#423610
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byronmfox(at)gmail.com
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| Posted: Sat May 24, 2014 10:10 am Post subject: Another Yak-52 'gear up' accident in Belgium ... 18 May 201 |
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Ditto, Bear!
Blitz Fox415-307-2405
On May 24, 2014, at 6:22 AM, "Walter Lannon" <wlannon(at)shaw.ca (wlannon(at)shaw.ca)> wrote:
[quote] Well said Randy
Walt
From: DaBear (dabear(at)damned.org)
Sent: Friday, May 23, 2014 11:47 AM
To: yak-list(at)matronics.com (yak-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: RE: Re: Another Yak-52 'gear up' accident in Belgium ... 18 May 201
So I think there are multiple parts to this.
This *IS* a forum for debate. If we can’t sit around and debate points to find the best answer, this forum is useless. If we expect someone to come with a question or comment and we should just all nod our heads in agreement to the first answer, etc. Then what service are we bringing? Debate is a good thing, personal attacks are NOT.
When someone posts a different opinion, they are NOT attacking someone, questioning their man/woman-hood/parentage, etc. It’s a different opinion. We need to stop getting our underwear in a bunch from some perceived slight because of how the text is read.
Example; some people get personally upset at curse words, others use them like adjectives throughout their speech. Go to NYC and the F bomb is used in saying good morning and how the )(*)& are you? Down south, that would be frowned upon in a huge way.
The words are just bunches of letters and you should understanding the meaning before getting upset. And in the case of the forum, they are bunches of letters and bunches of words. People typically respond on this forum quickly, without a lot of proof reading and without worry in how their quickly worded response will be received. Take 80-95% of what is on this forum as people trying to help. Otherwise, you might as well get off the internet because it is this way across thousands of forums.
As to this thread, 11 skydivers didn’t die because of a gear up landing. We’ve discussed multiple options to prevent gear up landings including experimental squat switches, horns, and modified knobs. While all those are good ideas of things to help, they will NOT prevent ALL gear up landings.
Sooo…
Give each other a hug, say you are sorry and let the spirited debate continue.
Or not…
Bear
From: owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-yak-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of doug sapp
Sent: Friday, May 23, 2014 1:12 PM
To: yak-list(at)matronics.com (yak-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: Re: Another Yak-52 'gear up' accident in Belgium ... 18 May 201
Why, gentlemen do we, more times than not end up pissing off the original poster who I am sure only had the best intentions? If we keep this up the list will be populated only by those who do not believe the the axiom "if you can't say something nice don't say anything at all". After all is said and done, what have you accomplished?
Doug Sapp
On Fri, May 23, 2014 at 9:59 AM, Michael B. Cavanagh <mikecavanagh1(at)hotmail.com (mikecavanagh1(at)hotmail.com)> wrote: [quote]
--> Yak-List message posted by: "Michael B. Cavanagh" <mikecavanagh1(at)hotmail.com (mikecavanagh1(at)hotmail.com)>
The point to this website is to share information, not debate and degrade others trying to share good ideas. I agree with you that the shape of the gear handle is no help when you've forgotten there is a handle at all. Staying current and proficient is your best defense. I never said knobs were a cure. Losing SA, and that is what forgetting the gear is about, is helped by being in front of the airplane and not being overly distracted when out of the ordinary things happen. No one is immune to forgetting the gear, and there is no one solution for preventing it. Read my paragraph again. That said, I'm dropping this website and you won't hear from me again, Mr. Mark G. Bitterlich. AMF
On May 23, 2014, at 9:33 AM, "Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD" <mark.bitterlich(at)navy.mil (mark.bitterlich(at)navy.mil)> wrote:
[quote] --> Yak-List message posted by: "Bitterlich, Mark G CIV NAVAIR, WD" <mark.bitterlich(at)navy.mil (mark.bitterlich(at)navy.mil)>
I think the point here is that having different shaped knobs can indeed help keep you from grabbing the wrong lever and thinking you put the gear down when it fact you did not. I don't personally believe that is an issue in the Yaks, maybe for the 52? Possible I guess. That said, I don't have any stinking flaps on the YAK-50, so it would not help me one little bit either Michael B. Cavanagh.
The point Keith made is perfectly apt, and that is that ANYONE in ANY make, model, series, of aircraft (unless it is down and welded) can be the victim of landing with the gear up, or not carefully noting that all THREE (or in my case TWO) green lights are on, etc. There have been many cases where I have been on short final and have said to myself: "Did I check the gear or not?" I don't hesitate, I look at them AGAIN. After it has happened to YOU, either some very close call, or actually scraping and skidding down the runway, you tend to become paranoid about it, which is probably a good thing.
Point is, the shape of the knob has no bearing on just simply forgetting to lower the dang gear, which is what Keith was alluding to and did not, in my opinion justify your publically written denigrating response, but then I have been guilty of that as well, so I have no room to talk.
By the way, Keith *IS* one of the smart people.
Mark Bitterlich
N50YK N66PW
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