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Mark 3 classic with VW power

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em0070(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Mar 03, 2024 12:13 pm Post subject: Mark 3 classic with VW power

Does anyone have any experience using the Great Plains vw engine with the newer front driven reduction drive? 



I'm looking to repower a Mark3 classic. 

Any suggestions, or comments,  and thoughts would be appreciated.  

Thanks 

Erich

cronmcclure(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Mar 03, 2024 1:42 pm Post subject: Mark 3 classic with VW power

I have a Mark III Extra with a Jabiru 2200.  Couldn't be happier.

Ron McClure

On Sun, Mar 3, 2024 at 1:14 PM Erich McGrew <em0070(at)gmail.com (em0070(at)gmail.com)> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  Does anyone have any experience using the Great Plains vw engine with the newer front driven reduction drive? 



I'm looking to repower a Mark3 classic. 

Any suggestions, or comments,  and thoughts would be appreciated.  

Thanks 

Erich

neilsenrm(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Mar 03, 2024 1:49 pm Post subject: Mark 3 classic with VW power

Erich

I was the first to put a reduction drive VW on a MKIII. Been flying it for over 15 years. I assume you are referring to Valley/Colver redrive with the serpentine belts. Note! redrive will not work with most of the GP engines. The GP engines that were built with the extra main bearing and extended crank for use as a direct drive will not work.

You are aware that you will need to have a VW engine mount welded to the frame?

Rick Neilsen

2180 cc redrive VW powered Kolb MKIIIC

On Sun, Mar 3, 2024 at 3:14 PM Erich McGrew <em0070(at)gmail.com (em0070(at)gmail.com)> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  Does anyone have any experience using the Great Plains vw engine with the newer front driven reduction drive? 



I'm looking to repower a Mark3 classic. 

Any suggestions, or comments,  and thoughts would be appreciated.  

Thanks 

Erich

neilsenrm(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 04, 2024 9:23 am Post subject: Mark 3 classic with VW power

Erich

The redrive VW is the least expensive option for powering a Kolb MKIII by a large margin. It will perform about like a 80 HP 912 Rotax. It weighs about 10-15 lbs more than a 912 with some trimming of unneeded material. The newer aluminium VW cases are a bit heavier. I'm happy to answer any questions.

Rick Neilsen

Redrive VW powered MKIIIC 

On Sun, Mar 3, 2024 at 3:14 PM Erich McGrew <em0070(at)gmail.com (em0070(at)gmail.com)> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  Does anyone have any experience using the Great Plains vw engine with the newer front driven reduction drive? 



I'm looking to repower a Mark3 classic. 

Any suggestions, or comments,  and thoughts would be appreciated.  

Thanks 

Erich

em0070(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 04, 2024 9:40 am Post subject: Mark 3 classic with VW power

Rick, 



Thanks for the info. 

I've inherited this airframe from a friend of my brothers. 

He attempted to build his using a vw and some type of redrive that ran off the flywheel end of the pulley. 

Sady Valley/Culver are no longer supplying the Redrive units. 

I was looking at the Great Plains unit that looks to be very similar to the Valley/Culver.



- 0014 / 1.7:1 Reduction Drive System #0014 (greatplainsas.com)



It seems that Great Plains is no longer selling the other style of front redrive that they used to sell. 

Any info and thoughts are appreciated.

Regards

Erich



On Mon, Mar 4, 2024 at 11:24 AM Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com (neilsenrm(at)gmail.com)> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  Erich

The redrive VW is the least expensive option for powering a Kolb MKIII by a large margin. It will perform about like a 80 HP 912 Rotax. It weighs about 10-15 lbs more than a 912 with some trimming of unneeded material. The newer aluminium VW cases are a bit heavier. I'm happy to answer any questions.

Rick Neilsen

Redrive VW powered MKIIIC 

On Sun, Mar 3, 2024 at 3:14 PM Erich McGrew <em0070(at)gmail.com (em0070(at)gmail.com)> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  Does anyone have any experience using the Great Plains vw engine with the newer front driven reduction drive? 



I'm looking to repower a Mark3 classic. 

Any suggestions, or comments,  and thoughts would be appreciated.  

Thanks 

Erich

neilsenrm(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 04, 2024 10:11 am Post subject: Mark 3 classic with VW power

Yes the GP redrive looks the same. I would assume it is the same redrive. I have a 1.6 redrive and the 1.7 might be a better fit. I first put a direct drive VW on my Kolb 

Rick Neilsen

On Mon, Mar 4, 2024 at 12:41 PM Erich McGrew <em0070(at)gmail.com (em0070(at)gmail.com)> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  Rick, 



Thanks for the info. 

I've inherited this airframe from a friend of my brothers. 

He attempted to build his using a vw and some type of redrive that ran off the flywheel end of the pulley. 

Sady Valley/Culver are no longer supplying the Redrive units. 

I was looking at the Great Plains unit that looks to be very similar to the Valley/Culver.



- 0014 / 1.7:1 Reduction Drive System #0014 (greatplainsas.com)



It seems that Great Plains is no longer selling the other style of front redrive that they used to sell. 

Any info and thoughts are appreciated.

Regards

Erich



On Mon, Mar 4, 2024 at 11:24 AM Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com (neilsenrm(at)gmail.com)> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  Erich

The redrive VW is the least expensive option for powering a Kolb MKIII by a large margin. It will perform about like a 80 HP 912 Rotax. It weighs about 10-15 lbs more than a 912 with some trimming of unneeded material. The newer aluminium VW cases are a bit heavier. I'm happy to answer any questions.

Rick Neilsen

Redrive VW powered MKIIIC 

On Sun, Mar 3, 2024 at 3:14 PM Erich McGrew <em0070(at)gmail.com (em0070(at)gmail.com)> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  Does anyone have any experience using the Great Plains vw engine with the newer front driven reduction drive? 



I'm looking to repower a Mark3 classic. 

Any suggestions, or comments,  and thoughts would be appreciated.  

Thanks 

Erich

Ceengland

Joined: 11 Oct 2020
Posts: 381
Location: MS

Posted: Mon Mar 04, 2024 11:03 am Post subject: Mark 3 classic with VW power

Might be worth looking at Air Trikes; they make a 'universal' gearbox that would likely work with a VW, since they work with both 3 & 4 cyl Suzuki & 4 cyl Subaru.

There's also Ace Aviation.  They've got multi-V belt drives running on clones of  the 80 HP Can Am 90 degree V-twins, with no 'damper' in the drive. Only way to do that is to make the drive incredibly stout.

With either of those, you'd likely need to come up with your own adapter. FWIW, given how far tech has come since the 1960s, if I were installing a 60-80 HP engine today the VW would not be on my list unless I already had one sitting on the bench ready to run. The little Yamaha Phazer (80 HP in the snowmobile and a reliable 70-75 in a plane) weighs almost exactly the same as a Rotax 582, with both ready to run. The Can Am clones (Gaokin) are a bit heavier with slightly less HP, but still a lot lighter than a VW.

Virus-free.www.avast.com[url=#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2][/url]



On Mon, Mar 4, 2024 at 11:41 AM Erich McGrew <em0070(at)gmail.com (em0070(at)gmail.com)> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  Rick, 



Thanks for the info. 

I've inherited this airframe from a friend of my brothers. 

He attempted to build his using a vw and some type of redrive that ran off the flywheel end of the pulley. 

Sady Valley/Culver are no longer supplying the Redrive units. 

I was looking at the Great Plains unit that looks to be very similar to the Valley/Culver.



- 0014 / 1.7:1 Reduction Drive System #0014 (greatplainsas.com)



It seems that Great Plains is no longer selling the other style of front redrive that they used to sell. 

Any info and thoughts are appreciated.

Regards

Erich



On Mon, Mar 4, 2024 at 11:24 AM Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com (neilsenrm(at)gmail.com)> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  Erich

The redrive VW is the least expensive option for powering a Kolb MKIII by a large margin. It will perform about like a 80 HP 912 Rotax. It weighs about 10-15 lbs more than a 912 with some trimming of unneeded material. The newer aluminium VW cases are a bit heavier. I'm happy to answer any questions.

Rick Neilsen

Redrive VW powered MKIIIC 

On Sun, Mar 3, 2024 at 3:14 PM Erich McGrew <em0070(at)gmail.com (em0070(at)gmail.com)> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  Does anyone have any experience using the Great Plains vw engine with the newer front driven reduction drive? 



I'm looking to repower a Mark3 classic. 

Any suggestions, or comments,  and thoughts would be appreciated.  

Thanks 

Erich

_________________
Charlie

brubakermal(at)yahoo.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 04, 2024 12:22 pm Post subject: Mark 3 classic with VW power

Charls england do you remember the yahoo user groups form?im looko g for some old information. Do you know much about how to go adout looking back at that stuff?



Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 

 

  On Mon, Mar 4, 2024 at 2:05 PM, Charlie England<ceengland7(at)gmail.com> wrote:   Might be worth looking at Air Trikes; they make a 'universal' gearbox that would likely work with a VW, since they work with both 3 & 4 cyl Suzuki & 4 cyl Subaru.There's also Ace Aviation.  They've got multi-V belt drives running on clones of  the 80 HP Can Am 90 degree V-twins, with no 'damper' in the drive. Only way to do that is to make the drive incredibly stout.

With either of those, you'd likely need to come up with your own adapter. FWIW, given how far tech has come since the 1960s, if I were installing a 60-80 HP engine today the VW would not be on my list unless I already had one sitting on the bench ready to run. The little Yamaha Phazer (80 HP in the snowmobile and a reliable 70-75 in a plane) weighs almost exactly the same as a Rotax 582, with both ready to run. The Can Am clones (Gaokin) are a bit heavier with slightly less HP, but still a lot lighter than a VW.



|  | Virus-free.www.avast.com |

On Mon, Mar 4, 2024 at 11:41 AM Erich McGrew <em0070(at)gmail.com> wrote:



Rick, 

Thanks for the info. I've inherited this airframe from a friend of my brothers. He attempted to build his using a vw and some type of redrive that ran off the flywheel end of the pulley. 

Sady Valley/Culver are no longer supplying the Redrive units. I was looking at the Great Plains unit that looks to be very similar to the Valley/Culver.



- 0014 / 1.7:1 Reduction Drive System #0014 (greatplainsas.com)



It seems that Great Plains is no longer selling the other style of front redrive that they used to sell. 

Any info and thoughts are appreciated.

RegardsErich

On Mon, Mar 4, 2024 at 11:24 AM Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com> wrote:



Erich

The redrive VW is the least expensive option for powering a Kolb MKIII by a large margin. It will perform about like a 80 HP 912 Rotax. It weighs about 10-15 lbs more than a 912 with some trimming of unneeded material. The newer aluminium VW cases are a bit heavier. I'm happy to answer any questions

neilsenrm(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Mar 04, 2024 3:09 pm Post subject: Mark 3 classic with VW power

Agreed but.



GA aircraft engines are much older design than VW with lower power power to

weight. They are still used in new designs because they are proven reliable

Ceengland

Joined: 11 Oct 2020
Posts: 381
Location: MS

Posted: Mon Mar 04, 2024 6:21 pm Post subject: Mark 3 classic with VW power

On Mon, Mar 4, 2024 at 5:11 PM Rick Neilsen <neilsenrm(at)gmail.com (neilsenrm(at)gmail.com)> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  Agreed but.

GA aircraft engines are much older design than VW with lower power power to weight. They are still used in new designs because they are proven reliable.

snipped

All good redrives have some form of harmonic dampener. Another Kolb/VW builder went with what was advertised as a strong gear drive without a dampener. Within just a few minutes he sheared a high strength drive shaft.

Keep us up to date on what you decide

Rick Neilsen

Redrive VW powered MKIIC  



 	  Quote: 	
		   	  Quote: 	
		  



	


	


	
No disagreement about the wisdom of using harmonic dampers; that's why I mentioned the lack of one on that belt drive (the Air Trikes gear drives *do* have HDs). But as I said, there are people running the Ace drives on big V-twins, so it's tempting to think that they may be doing something right.   

In any case, the Air Trikes guy seems to have a great reputation.

Charlie



Virus-free.www.avast.com[url=#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2][/url]

_________________
Charlie

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