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Z101 main alt wiring

 
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david(at)carter.net
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2020 10:41 am    Post subject: Z101 main alt wiring Reply with quote

Bob, 

Tracing the main alt field circuit from the main bus, I see the following wire sizes:
- 16 AWG fusible link
- 12 AWG wire to 5A breaker & then to power master switch
- 20 AWG wire to regulator
- 20 AWG wire to alternator field 
I don't understand the need for the 12 AWG wire feeding the master, which has only 20 AWG coming out of it to the load. 
Thanks,
David 


---
David Carter
david(at)carter.net (david(at)carter.net)


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ceengland7(at)gmail.com
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2020 11:26 am    Post subject: Z101 main alt wiring Reply with quote

On Mon, Jun 8, 2020 at 1:47 PM David Carter <david(at)carter.net (david(at)carter.net)> wrote:

Quote:
Bob, 

Tracing the main alt field circuit from the main bus, I see the following wire sizes:
- 16 AWG fusible link
- 12 AWG wire to 5A breaker & then to power master switch
- 20 AWG wire to regulator
- 20 AWG wire to alternator field 
I don't understand the need for the 12 AWG wire feeding the master, which has only 20 AWG coming out of it to the load. 
Thanks,
David 


---
David Carter
david(at)carter.net (david(at)carter.net)



Reasonable question; might have been driven by 'off-the-shelf' fusible link size availability. 22awg (minimum reasonable size to work with) link (sleeved with silicone tubing) to 18awg would get the job done. 20awg after the breaker because the breaker protects it.
I've tested the silicone tubing trick on 22awg with a direct short on a 12v tractor battery. The wire vaporizes, leaving a smoky interior lining on the clear silicone tubing, but the tubing contained the 'event'.
Charlie


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david(at)carter.net
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2020 6:30 am    Post subject: Z101 main alt wiring Reply with quote

Charlie, 

Thanks for the response. What type of silicone tubing do you use for this? 
Regards,
David
---
David Carter
david(at)carter.net (david(at)carter.net)

On Mon, Jun 8, 2020 at 3:30 PM Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com (ceengland7(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

Quote:


On Mon, Jun 8, 2020 at 1:47 PM David Carter <david(at)carter.net (david(at)carter.net)> wrote:

Quote:
Bob, 

Tracing the main alt field circuit from the main bus, I see the following wire sizes:
- 16 AWG fusible link
- 12 AWG wire to 5A breaker & then to power master switch
- 20 AWG wire to regulator
- 20 AWG wire to alternator field 
I don't understand the need for the 12 AWG wire feeding the master, which has only 20 AWG coming out of it to the load. 
Thanks,
David 


---
David Carter
david(at)carter.net (david(at)carter.net)



Reasonable question; might have been driven by 'off-the-shelf' fusible link size availability. 22awg (minimum reasonable size to work with) link (sleeved with silicone tubing) to 18awg would get the job done. 20awg after the breaker because the breaker protects it.
I've tested the silicone tubing trick on 22awg with a direct short on a 12v tractor battery. The wire vaporizes, leaving a smoky interior lining on the clear silicone tubing, but the tubing contained the 'event'.
Charlie


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ceengland7(at)gmail.com
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2020 7:17 am    Post subject: Z101 main alt wiring Reply with quote

On 6/10/2020 9:26 AM, David Carter wrote:

Quote:
Charlie, 

Thanks for the response. What type of silicone tubing do you use for this? 


Regards,
David
---
David Carter
david(at)carter.net (david(at)carter.net)





On Mon, Jun 8, 2020 at 3:30 PM Charlie England <ceengland7(at)gmail.com (ceengland7(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

Quote:




On Mon, Jun 8, 2020 at 1:47 PM David Carter <david(at)carter.net (david(at)carter.net)> wrote:

Quote:
Bob, 

Tracing the main alt field circuit from the main bus, I see the following wire sizes:
- 16 AWG fusible link
- 12 AWG wire to 5A breaker & then to power master switch
- 20 AWG wire to regulator
- 20 AWG wire to alternator field 


I don't understand the need for the 12 AWG wire feeding the master, which has only 20 AWG coming out of it to the load. 


Thanks,
David 




---
David Carter
david(at)carter.net (david(at)carter.net)





Reasonable question; might have been driven by 'off-the-shelf' fusible link size availability. 22awg (minimum reasonable size to work with) link (sleeved with silicone tubing) to 18awg would get the job done. 20awg after the breaker because the breaker protects it.


I've tested the silicone tubing trick on 22awg with a direct short on a 12v tractor battery. The wire vaporizes, leaving a smoky interior lining on the clear silicone tubing, but the tubing contained the 'event'.
Charlie



Hi David,

I don't even remember the source; probably ebay or Amazon. I just bought clear 'food grade' silicone tubing in an assortment of diameters.
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2334524.m570.l1313.TR9.TRC1.A0.H0.Xsilicone+tubing+.TRS2&_nkw=silicone+tubing+&_sacat=0&LH_TitleDesc=0&_osacat=0&_odkw=silicone+tubing+assortment

Charlie
Virus-free. www.avast.com [url=#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2] [/url]


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nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2020 10:07 am    Post subject: Z101 main alt wiring Reply with quote

Quote:

Reasonable question; might have been driven by 'off-the-shelf' fusible link size availability. 22awg (minimum reasonable size to work with) link (sleeved with silicone tubing) to 18awg would get the job done. 20awg after the breaker because the breaker protects it.

I've tested the silicone tubing trick on 22awg with a direct short on a 12v tractor battery. The wire vaporizes, leaving a smoky interior lining on the clear silicone tubing, but the tubing contained the 'event'.
Charlie

Those sizes are still 'in work' . . . 20AWG is the smallest
commericial-off-the-shelf (COTS) fusible link wire I've found . . .
and is just fine when extended with 16AWG wire.

There is no benefit in 'fine tuning' fusible link
sizes. I'm thinking we're going to find that the range
of COTS wires will cover all our needs. I'd guess that
99.9% of all breakers and fuses installed in vehicles go
to the scrap yard never having been called upon to do
their job.

Fusible links are probably an order of magnitude
LESS likely to be 'faulted' into service.

Z101 and 102 suggest some FLW as jumpers between
contactors/relays . . . I've been pondering these
choices and have just about concluded that making
those jumpers short, robust and mechanically
protected is all that's practical and useful.



Bob . . .


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nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2020 10:41 am    Post subject: Z101 main alt wiring Reply with quote

Quote:
Hi David,

I don't even remember the source; probably ebay or Amazon. I just bought clear 'food grade' silicone tubing in an assortment of diameters.
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2334524.m570.l1313.TR9.TRC1.A0.H0.Xsilicone+tubing+.TRS2&_nkw=silicone+tubing+&_sacat=0&LH_TitleDesc=0&_osacat=0&_odkw=silicone+tubing+assortment

Charlie

B&C sells fusible link kits that include
a silicone over fiberglas sleeving to
coral the destruction products of what
ever wire you want to run inside.

https://tinyurl.com/ya2nzddh

You can acquire silicon/fiberglas sleeving
in various sizes/lengths here

https://tinyurl.com/ybwnk7md




Bob . . .


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ceengland7(at)gmail.com
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2020 11:58 am    Post subject: Z101 main alt wiring Reply with quote

On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 1:12 PM Robert L. Nuckolls, III <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com (nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com)> wrote:

[quote]
Quote:

Reasonable question; might have been driven by 'off-the-shelf' fusible link size availability. 22awg (minimum reasonable size to work with) link (sleeved with silicone tubing) to 18awg would get the job done. 20awg after the breaker because the breaker protects it.

I've tested the silicone tubing trick on 22awg with a direct short on a 12v tractor battery. The wire vaporizes, leaving a smoky interior lining on the clear silicone tubing, but the tubing contained the 'event'.
Charlie

  Those sizes are still 'in work' . . . 20AWG is the smallest
  commericial-off-the-shelf (COTS) fusible link wire I've found .


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ceengland7(at)gmail.com
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2020 12:01 pm    Post subject: Z101 main alt wiring Reply with quote

On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 2:10 PM Robert L. Nuckolls, III <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com (nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com)> wrote:

Quote:
Quote:
Hi David,

I don't even remember the source; probably ebay or Amazon. I just bought clear 'food grade' silicone tubing in an assortment of diameters.
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2334524.m570.l1313.TR9.TRC1.A0.H0.Xsilicone+tubing+.TRS2&_nkw=silicone+tubing+&_sacat=0&LH_TitleDesc=0&_osacat=0&_odkw=silicone+tubing+assortment

Charlie

  B&C sells fusible link kits that include
  a silicone over fiberglas sleeving to
  coral the destruction products of what
  ever wire you want to run inside.

https://tinyurl.com/ya2nzddh

  You can acquire silicon/fiberglas sleeving
  in various sizes/lengths here

https://tinyurl.com/ybwnk7md




  Bob . . .


I wish I'd been able to find that when I fab'd mine, but it's been a while. Pretty sure it wasn't available back then. Pure silicone is 'good enough', but the Fglas stuff there is no more expensive, so I'll go there for future work. Thanks for the link!
Charlie


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