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jkuehn(at)mountaintime.my
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 Posted: Wed Mar 29, 2006 6:44 pm Post subject: legal Cell phone |
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That is interesting, and I bet not too many pilots know this. Why then
are the airlines still telling us to turn our digital cell phones off?
Do the pilots, as a matter of company policy, "decide" they are not
"safe?"
Brian Lloyd wrote:
| Quote: |
Dave Morris "BigD" wrote:
>
>
>Unless I'm mistaken, I believe it is still against FCC regulations
>(47CFR 22.925) to operate a cellular phone onboard an aircraft that
>is in the air. This is because the signal will be picked up by
>multiple cell towers at the same time and will lock out a significant
>amount of bandwidth.
>
>
That is indeed the case for AMPS phones (the old analog cell-phone
technology). The newer digital PCS phones operate under a different set
of rules. These phones, CDMA, TDMA, GSM, etc., may be used in-flight.
There are no FCC limitations on that. The FAA limitation (part 91
operations) is that the pilot must determine that the operation of the
phone does not present a hazard to aircraft operation or navigation.
|
--
Jack Kuehn
5565 Brady Lane
Lolo, MT 59847
(406) 273-6801
(406) 546-1086 (cell)
(406) 273-2563 (fax)
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brian
Joined: 02 Jan 2006
Posts: 643
Location: Sacramento, California, USA
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| Posted: Wed Mar 29, 2006 7:35 pm Post subject: legal Cell phone |
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Jack Kuehn wrote:
| Quote: |
That is interesting, and I bet not too many pilots know this. Why then
are the airlines still telling us to turn our digital cell phones off?
Do the pilots, as a matter of company policy, "decide" they are not
"safe?"
|
Correct. The rules for part 121 and 135 ops are different than they are
for part 91. The pilots have no discretion in that case.
--
Brian Lloyd 361 Catterline Way
brian-yak at lloyd dot com Folsom, CA 95630
+1.916.367.2131 (voice) +1.270.912.0788 (fax)
I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . .
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery
| | - The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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_________________
Brian Lloyd
brian-yak at lloyd dot com
+1.916.367.2131 (voice) +1.270.912.0788 (fax)
I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . .
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery |
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jschroeder(at)perigee.net
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| Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2006 5:44 am Post subject: legal Cell phone |
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Do Not Archive
I'm very indebted and relieved if this is the case, and hope it will
remain the policy of the airlines to ban the use of cell phones while the
aircraft is away from the gate. I can imagine how bad it would be to be
held captive for hours while the usual cell phone bore orders an underling
or their secretary around in a loud voice, or relates intimate details
from the previous night's liaison, or in a similarly loud voice, relates
in detail the long string of other problems in their life. In a restaurant
or the terminal one can put some distance between the annoyance and
themselves. In the usual crammed cattle car we fly in these days? Abu
Ghraib anyone?
Cheers,
John Schroeder
On Wed, 29 Mar 2006 19:42:34 -0700, Jack Kuehn
<jkuehn(at)mountaintime.myrf.net> wrote:
| Quote: | Do the pilots, as a matter of company policy, "decide" they are not
"safe?"
|
--
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BigD(at)DaveMorris.com
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2006 6:50 am Post subject: legal Cell phone |
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From 91.21:
"In the case of an aircraft operated by a holder of an air carrier
operating certificate or an operating certificate, the determination
required by paragraph (b)(5) of this section shall be made by that
operator of the aircraft on which the particular device is to be
used. In the case of other aircraft, the determination may be made by
the pilot in command or other operator of the aircraft."
Operator not = pilot.
Dave Morris
At 08:42 PM 3/29/2006, you wrote:
| Quote: |
<jkuehn(at)mountaintime.myrf.net>
That is interesting, and I bet not too many pilots know this. Why then
are the airlines still telling us to turn our digital cell phones off?
Do the pilots, as a matter of company policy, "decide" they are not
"safe?"
Brian Lloyd wrote:
>
>
>
>
>Dave Morris "BigD" wrote:
>
>
>>
<BigD(at)DaveMorris.com>
>>
>>Unless I'm mistaken, I believe it is still against FCC regulations
>>(47CFR 22.925) to operate a cellular phone onboard an aircraft that
>>is in the air. This is because the signal will be picked up by
>>multiple cell towers at the same time and will lock out a significant
>>amount of bandwidth.
>>
>>
>
>That is indeed the case for AMPS phones (the old analog cell-phone
>technology). The newer digital PCS phones operate under a different set
>of rules. These phones, CDMA, TDMA, GSM, etc., may be used in-flight.
>There are no FCC limitations on that. The FAA limitation (part 91
>operations) is that the pilot must determine that the operation of the
>phone does not present a hazard to aircraft operation or navigation.
>
>
>
--
Jack Kuehn
5565 Brady Lane
Lolo, MT 59847
(406) 273-6801
(406) 546-1086 (cell)
(406) 273-2563 (fax)
|
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Mark Phillips in TN
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 431
Location: Columbia, TN
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| Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2006 8:28 am Post subject: legal Cell phone |
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In a message dated 3/29/06 8:46:09 PM Central Standard Time,
jkuehn(at)mountaintime.myrf.net writes:
| Quote: | Why then
are the airlines still telling us to turn our digital cell phones off?
Do the pilots, as a matter of company policy, "decide" they are not
"safe?"
|
Actually, the pilots would face a major revolt from flight attendants who do
not want to face complaints from passengers and enforce usage guidelines. F/A
union members almost unanimously object to cell phone use in commercial
aircraft, and if I were sitting elbow to elbow with someone endlessly blabbing
while I was trying to get some work done or take a nap, I'd be pretty upset. I
have heard some discussion about turning the old smoking sections into yakking
areas. Where would we be without our addictions?
Bryan- how does one determine type of cell phone? Anything newer than "X"
years OK? All dualbands OK? TIA!
Mark - do not archive
| | - The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List |
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_________________
From The PossumWorks... |
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brian
Joined: 02 Jan 2006
Posts: 643
Location: Sacramento, California, USA
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| Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2006 9:42 am Post subject: legal Cell phone |
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Fiveonepw(at)aol.com wrote:
| Quote: | Bryan- how does one determine type of cell phone? Anything newer than "X"
years OK? All dualbands OK? TIA!
|
In the US Sprint, Cingular, AT&T, and Verizon all operate under the PCS
laws. Only the older cell-phone franchises still have AMPS. AMPS doesn't
support any of the newer features like text messaging, internet access,
picture phone capability, etc. Customer feature requirements dictate
that one sell PCS services these days.
So virtually all phones sold today are PCS.
For instance, my phone, a Samsung SP500i from Sprint, has three choices
under "roming":
-automatic
-Sprint
-analog
By setting it to "Sprint" I prevent it from switching to analog (AMPS)
roaming mode.
But the definitive answer is: RTFM. 
Brian Lloyd
brian HYPHEN yak AT lloyd DOT com
| | - The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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_________________
Brian Lloyd
brian-yak at lloyd dot com
+1.916.367.2131 (voice) +1.270.912.0788 (fax)
I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . .
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery |
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Mark Phillips in TN
Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 431
Location: Columbia, TN
|
| Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2006 10:20 am Post subject: legal Cell phone |
|
|
| Quote: | But the definitive answer is: RTFM.
|
Absolutely- thanks again Brian and apologies for the (y) mispel-
Mark do not archive
| | - The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List |
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_________________
From The PossumWorks... |
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jabowenjr(at)hotmail.com
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2006 9:46 pm Post subject: legal Cell phone |
|
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My experience is that cell phones don't work above a few thousand feet AGL
anyway. I'm not sure what the actual altitude is where they start to work. I
hesitate to say more.
Jim Bowen
RV-8
| Quote: | From: Fiveonepw(at)aol.com
Reply-To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: legal Cell phone
Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2006 11:25:09 EST
In a message dated 3/29/06 8:46:09 PM Central Standard Time,
jkuehn(at)mountaintime.myrf.net writes:
> Why then
> are the airlines still telling us to turn our digital cell phones off?
> Do the pilots, as a matter of company policy, "decide" they are not
> "safe?"
>>>
Actually, the pilots would face a major revolt from flight attendants who
do
not want to face complaints from passengers and enforce usage guidelines.
F/A
union members almost unanimously object to cell phone use in commercial
aircraft, and if I were sitting elbow to elbow with someone endlessly
blabbing
while I was trying to get some work done or take a nap, I'd be pretty
upset. I
have heard some discussion about turning the old smoking sections into
yakking
areas. Where would we be without our addictions?
Bryan- how does one determine type of cell phone? Anything newer than "X"
years OK? All dualbands OK? TIA!
Mark - do not archive
|
| | - The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List |
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